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	<title>Comments on: A Lot of Questions This Fine Thursday Morn</title>
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	<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/</link>
	<description>Mormon women blogging about the peculiar and the treasured</description>
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		<title>By: Rachelle</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102501</link>
		<dc:creator>Rachelle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Sep 2008 21:21:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102501</guid>
		<description>I kind of look at it like this. I don&#039;t put my foot out in front of my child so she can trip or cause her to run into the wall 15 times a day. She does this all on her own. This is her environment. This is where she grows. But I don&#039;t abandon her in the house alone either. Sometimes, I warn her about the obstacles in her path, sometimes I physically move real danger out of her way. Sometimes I kiss the owies away and hug her and hold her until she feels better. I am really never far away from my children. They know where to find me. Yes I believe God has a mission for us. He wants us to accept the destiny he has planned for us. But he is a parent and he will not physically force our growth. He cannot, due to his promise of agency, stop the natural courses of our life from happening to us.  He will however help us (in miraculous ways sometimes) find the way to fulfill our potential, which I truly believe he understands more than we can ever comprehend.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I kind of look at it like this. I don&#8217;t put my foot out in front of my child so she can trip or cause her to run into the wall 15 times a day. She does this all on her own. This is her environment. This is where she grows. But I don&#8217;t abandon her in the house alone either. Sometimes, I warn her about the obstacles in her path, sometimes I physically move real danger out of her way. Sometimes I kiss the owies away and hug her and hold her until she feels better. I am really never far away from my children. They know where to find me. Yes I believe God has a mission for us. He wants us to accept the destiny he has planned for us. But he is a parent and he will not physically force our growth. He cannot, due to his promise of agency, stop the natural courses of our life from happening to us.  He will however help us (in miraculous ways sometimes) find the way to fulfill our potential, which I truly believe he understands more than we can ever comprehend.</p>
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		<title>By: m&#38;m</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102413</link>
		<dc:creator>m&#38;m</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Sep 2008 05:55:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102413</guid>
		<description>jendoop -- don&#039;t you love it when that happens? I&#039;m glad it was meaningful for you.

Elder Holland is one of my heroes.

Hang in there, sister.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>jendoop &#8212; don&#8217;t you love it when that happens? I&#8217;m glad it was meaningful for you.</p>
<p>Elder Holland is one of my heroes.</p>
<p>Hang in there, sister.</p>
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		<title>By: jendoop</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102297</link>
		<dc:creator>jendoop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Sep 2008 13:18:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102297</guid>
		<description>m&amp;m - After finishing Elder Holland&#039;s talk which you recommended I&#039;m very thankful for the link. What amazing council that I was in dire need of although I would not have sought it out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>m&amp;m &#8211; After finishing Elder Holland&#8217;s talk which you recommended I&#8217;m very thankful for the link. What amazing council that I was in dire need of although I would not have sought it out.</p>
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		<title>By: s'mee</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102255</link>
		<dc:creator>s'mee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 13 Sep 2008 05:58:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102255</guid>
		<description>Coming late to the party...

He is our Father and KNOWS us perfectly because He *is* God after all. 

Now think of *your* earthly family, your home, your children...how well do you know them? Can you with your *human* mind and wisdom, reasonably predict how each of your children will react in a certain situation?  I know, for me, Fireman would test, Painter would follow, Tooth Faery would stand firm, Electro-Man would experiment, and the Scholar would search and search and search some more.

There *are* physical laws to which all are bound, even God, so, if like my brother, you make a huge mistake driving one day, more than likely unless the Lord has a MAJOR reason for you hanging out, you&#039;ll live with your mistake, or as in my brother&#039;s case, die.

The scriptures explain that all good comes from God, however all experience, good, bad and ugly are for our benefit... take from that what you may, perspective gives us blessings and wisdom. Also- that *God* would not tempt us beyond our control...no one has put a limit on Satan, although we have moral agency -and really, all Satan is trying to do is get us to relinquish it; he never wanted us to have choice, so the temptations we face from him usually end in our losing our ability to choose further.

There is an ultimate plan, but as in life here on earth we *do* have will.  We can explain to our own kids that such and such should and will be happening on the 4th of July, however, if they choose to ignore, oppose, alter, or otherwise miss out on the family day, there ain&#039;t much you as a parent can do other than dole out a reward/consequence for their choice. Same with us I suppose. He lays it out for us and we choose to follow, risk, go out for a soda or whatever. In the end our little choices can indeed alter His plan, for good or ill.

This is why we have the Atonement and a plan that is fair and well thought out to give us every opportunity to be saved and exalted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Coming late to the party&#8230;</p>
<p>He is our Father and KNOWS us perfectly because He *is* God after all. </p>
<p>Now think of *your* earthly family, your home, your children&#8230;how well do you know them? Can you with your *human* mind and wisdom, reasonably predict how each of your children will react in a certain situation?  I know, for me, Fireman would test, Painter would follow, Tooth Faery would stand firm, Electro-Man would experiment, and the Scholar would search and search and search some more.</p>
<p>There *are* physical laws to which all are bound, even God, so, if like my brother, you make a huge mistake driving one day, more than likely unless the Lord has a MAJOR reason for you hanging out, you&#8217;ll live with your mistake, or as in my brother&#8217;s case, die.</p>
<p>The scriptures explain that all good comes from God, however all experience, good, bad and ugly are for our benefit&#8230; take from that what you may, perspective gives us blessings and wisdom. Also- that *God* would not tempt us beyond our control&#8230;no one has put a limit on Satan, although we have moral agency -and really, all Satan is trying to do is get us to relinquish it; he never wanted us to have choice, so the temptations we face from him usually end in our losing our ability to choose further.</p>
<p>There is an ultimate plan, but as in life here on earth we *do* have will.  We can explain to our own kids that such and such should and will be happening on the 4th of July, however, if they choose to ignore, oppose, alter, or otherwise miss out on the family day, there ain&#8217;t much you as a parent can do other than dole out a reward/consequence for their choice. Same with us I suppose. He lays it out for us and we choose to follow, risk, go out for a soda or whatever. In the end our little choices can indeed alter His plan, for good or ill.</p>
<p>This is why we have the Atonement and a plan that is fair and well thought out to give us every opportunity to be saved and exalted.</p>
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		<title>By: m&#38;m</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102201</link>
		<dc:creator>m&#38;m</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Sep 2008 23:38:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102201</guid>
		<description>If you want a beautiful exploration and testimony related to this topic, read this from cjane:

http://blog.cjanerun.com/2008/08/no-sting.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you want a beautiful exploration and testimony related to this topic, read this from cjane:</p>
<p><a href="http://blog.cjanerun.com/2008/08/no-sting.html" rel="nofollow">http://blog.cjanerun.com/2008/08/no-sting.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Jenny</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102172</link>
		<dc:creator>Jenny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Sep 2008 21:10:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102172</guid>
		<description>From the Bible Dictionary under Prayer:

Prayer is the act by which the will of the Father and the will of the child are brought into correspondence with each other. The object of prayer is not to change the will of God, but to secure for ourselves and for others blessings that God is already willing to grant, but that are made conditional on our asking for them. Blessings require some work or effort on our part before we can obtain them. Prayer is a form of work, and is an appointed means for obtaining the highest of all blessings.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From the Bible Dictionary under Prayer:</p>
<p>Prayer is the act by which the will of the Father and the will of the child are brought into correspondence with each other. The object of prayer is not to change the will of God, but to secure for ourselves and for others blessings that God is already willing to grant, but that are made conditional on our asking for them. Blessings require some work or effort on our part before we can obtain them. Prayer is a form of work, and is an appointed means for obtaining the highest of all blessings.</p>
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		<title>By: m&#38;m</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102079</link>
		<dc:creator>m&#38;m</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Sep 2008 07:47:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102079</guid>
		<description>I tend to agree with Mrs. Organic, including the part that it is hard to put it all into words!

I think part of the challenge we face is that we are mortal, and so we judge &#039;good&#039; and &#039;bad&#039; and such with the perspective of a mortal. Some tragedies are so overwhelming to us that we can&#039;t place them in a place in our minds, hearts, or spirits where they equate in any way with God. But I think that reflects the limits of our mortality. Death, challenges, tragedies -- what do those look like in eternity? While God reaches us in our pain here, and empathizes with it, I don&#039;t think He sees our pain in the same way that we do, and He lets us experience it all for our good. (Elder Holland, anyone? If you haven&#039;t heard his CES talk from this last week, it&#039;s stunning.)

I listened to an entire tape series on really being grateful to God for everything. This speaker helped me realize that the scripture says to acknowledge His hand in ALL things. All things. That is a lot of things. :)

For me, in part, that is coming to mean that I let go of needing to believe that God can only be involved in what *I think* is good. Because honestly, we can&#039;t need a Savior without a fall, and we each have the Fall in us and falls (multiple ones) in our lives. The opposition is as much a part of His love and plan as the blessings, because how else can we really need and appreciate the Savior? If there was no death, how could we rejoice in the resurrection? If there was no agency, how could we rejoice in mercy? If there was no pain, how could we learn to find healing in Him? If everything always worked out as we wanted, what of faith?

God may not *cause* all of the bad, but He doesn&#039;t stop it either, and He could. That still leaves me with Him being in control. Since &quot;He doeth not anything save it be for the benefit of the world&quot; (and I take that to a personal level, too), then I think everything can have a purpose, because, if for no other reason, like Justine said, we get to choose how we respond. And agency is the key to the Atonement.

The tension between our agency and His omniscience and omnipotence is really hard to navigate, but for me, I feel the only way I can begin to engage in that exercise is to let go of my &#039;natural&#039; responses to the messiness and difficulty and pain of life and try to see more with spiritual eyes. When I do that, the usual thoughts about what &#039;should&#039; be or what is &#039;fair&#039; or &#039;good&#039; pretty much fly out the window. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I tend to agree with Mrs. Organic, including the part that it is hard to put it all into words!</p>
<p>I think part of the challenge we face is that we are mortal, and so we judge &#8216;good&#8217; and &#8216;bad&#8217; and such with the perspective of a mortal. Some tragedies are so overwhelming to us that we can&#8217;t place them in a place in our minds, hearts, or spirits where they equate in any way with God. But I think that reflects the limits of our mortality. Death, challenges, tragedies &#8212; what do those look like in eternity? While God reaches us in our pain here, and empathizes with it, I don&#8217;t think He sees our pain in the same way that we do, and He lets us experience it all for our good. (Elder Holland, anyone? If you haven&#8217;t heard his CES talk from this last week, it&#8217;s stunning.)</p>
<p>I listened to an entire tape series on really being grateful to God for everything. This speaker helped me realize that the scripture says to acknowledge His hand in ALL things. All things. That is a lot of things. <img src='http://segullah.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>For me, in part, that is coming to mean that I let go of needing to believe that God can only be involved in what *I think* is good. Because honestly, we can&#8217;t need a Savior without a fall, and we each have the Fall in us and falls (multiple ones) in our lives. The opposition is as much a part of His love and plan as the blessings, because how else can we really need and appreciate the Savior? If there was no death, how could we rejoice in the resurrection? If there was no agency, how could we rejoice in mercy? If there was no pain, how could we learn to find healing in Him? If everything always worked out as we wanted, what of faith?</p>
<p>God may not *cause* all of the bad, but He doesn&#8217;t stop it either, and He could. That still leaves me with Him being in control. Since &#8220;He doeth not anything save it be for the benefit of the world&#8221; (and I take that to a personal level, too), then I think everything can have a purpose, because, if for no other reason, like Justine said, we get to choose how we respond. And agency is the key to the Atonement.</p>
<p>The tension between our agency and His omniscience and omnipotence is really hard to navigate, but for me, I feel the only way I can begin to engage in that exercise is to let go of my &#8216;natural&#8217; responses to the messiness and difficulty and pain of life and try to see more with spiritual eyes. When I do that, the usual thoughts about what &#8216;should&#8217; be or what is &#8216;fair&#8217; or &#8216;good&#8217; pretty much fly out the window. <img src='http://segullah.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Jessie</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102063</link>
		<dc:creator>Jessie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Sep 2008 05:13:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102063</guid>
		<description>I love what a lot of these woman have to say here.

For me, I find comfort in believing that we are all here to learn something one way or another.  We are always taught that God knows us...but one reason we are here is to learn to know ourselves and the things that happen around us aren&#039;t orchestrated by God in the sense that they are scripted, but instead, I think they are designed to teach us about ourselves and each other and hopefully God, too.  

Just as Cheryl said, I know my toddler pretty well, but he&#039;s still discovering himself AND me.  Sometimes I help him out, sometimes I watch him struggle.  And sometimes I&#039;m surprised at how well things turn out without my help.  I think God is the ultimate parent doing the same for us.  I like to believe that God feels the same way about us as I do about my baby.  It&#039;s all about learning and growing....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love what a lot of these woman have to say here.</p>
<p>For me, I find comfort in believing that we are all here to learn something one way or another.  We are always taught that God knows us&#8230;but one reason we are here is to learn to know ourselves and the things that happen around us aren&#8217;t orchestrated by God in the sense that they are scripted, but instead, I think they are designed to teach us about ourselves and each other and hopefully God, too.  </p>
<p>Just as Cheryl said, I know my toddler pretty well, but he&#8217;s still discovering himself AND me.  Sometimes I help him out, sometimes I watch him struggle.  And sometimes I&#8217;m surprised at how well things turn out without my help.  I think God is the ultimate parent doing the same for us.  I like to believe that God feels the same way about us as I do about my baby.  It&#8217;s all about learning and growing&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Mrs. Organic</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102022</link>
		<dc:creator>Mrs. Organic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Sep 2008 23:08:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102022</guid>
		<description>How about this take on it? I think that all of it - the good and the bad is just a part of being here, of getting our body. I think we knew it coming into this experience and decided it was still worth it. 

I don&#039;t think we knew exactly what our trials and blessings would be, but that we would have both and were willing to submit to them for the oppportunity of having a body. Because, let&#039;s face it - bodies are awesome! 

I think the Hand of God is everywhere in our life, we just have to look for and notice it. My son is disabled too, and when he is really suffering, that is when I have the hardest time noticing the Hand of God in his life - but it is still there.

I have many more thoughts on this, but it&#039;s difficult to put them into words.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How about this take on it? I think that all of it &#8211; the good and the bad is just a part of being here, of getting our body. I think we knew it coming into this experience and decided it was still worth it. </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think we knew exactly what our trials and blessings would be, but that we would have both and were willing to submit to them for the oppportunity of having a body. Because, let&#8217;s face it &#8211; bodies are awesome! </p>
<p>I think the Hand of God is everywhere in our life, we just have to look for and notice it. My son is disabled too, and when he is really suffering, that is when I have the hardest time noticing the Hand of God in his life &#8211; but it is still there.</p>
<p>I have many more thoughts on this, but it&#8217;s difficult to put them into words.</p>
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		<title>By: Maddison</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/daily-special/a-lot-of-questions-this-fine-thursday-morn/#comment-102020</link>
		<dc:creator>Maddison</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Sep 2008 22:57:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=1031#comment-102020</guid>
		<description>Maybe I&#039;m wrong, but I feel that even though He is all-knowing, I don&#039;t feel like that means I ultimately don&#039;t still have free agency. I still have to come to those conclusions and make those decisions myself. Maybe I&#039;m overly simplistic in my thinking, but that&#039;s where prayer comes in. When I am stuck in my decisions (all too often) that&#039;s when I lean on the Lord, I call out for His guidance - because He knows what&#039;s best for me. Does that make sense? 

We are studying this in my critical thinking class right now, actually. Well, we&#039;re talking about how some groups (I stay out of the specifics in class because I am in a secular school) believe that God is all-knowing and yet that men still have free will. It&#039;s an interesting thing to ponder. Just in my thoughts thus far, the two can coexist - despite the fact that my teacher insists that they can&#039;t.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe I&#8217;m wrong, but I feel that even though He is all-knowing, I don&#8217;t feel like that means I ultimately don&#8217;t still have free agency. I still have to come to those conclusions and make those decisions myself. Maybe I&#8217;m overly simplistic in my thinking, but that&#8217;s where prayer comes in. When I am stuck in my decisions (all too often) that&#8217;s when I lean on the Lord, I call out for His guidance &#8211; because He knows what&#8217;s best for me. Does that make sense? </p>
<p>We are studying this in my critical thinking class right now, actually. Well, we&#8217;re talking about how some groups (I stay out of the specifics in class because I am in a secular school) believe that God is all-knowing and yet that men still have free will. It&#8217;s an interesting thing to ponder. Just in my thoughts thus far, the two can coexist &#8211; despite the fact that my teacher insists that they can&#8217;t.</p>
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