Dreams as Spiritual Gifts: An Interview with Barbara Bishop

Posted by Emily M. | May 13, 2010 | 13 Comments

One of my favorite pieces we’ve ever published is “Dreams as Gifts of the Spirit,” an analysis of dream-related LDS history, doctrine, and practice. I have occasionally experienced powerful dreams myself, and I have always been grateful for the wisdom with which Barbara Bishop, the author (and also my aunt), helps me understand my dreams.

Barbara Bishop has an undergraduate degree in English from the University of Utah, a PhD in English from UCLA, and a master’s in counseling psychology from Pacifica Graduate Institute. She taught English, using a curriculum that combined dreams and literature, for seven years at Marymount College in Palos Verdes, California. In addition to her work as a therapist, she is also writing a book about addiction dreams. She is married to Brent Pace and has three beautiful boys, about whom she dreams regularly.

As research for her book on addiction dreams, Barbara is seeking dreams from addicts and recovered addicts. If you have a family member who is an addict, she is interested in your dreams as well. Please email me –emilymilner at byu dot net–if you have an addiction-related dream you would like to share with her.

When did you first begin to pay attention to your dreams and what they might mean?
I first became interested in dreams while I was writing my dissertation for my PhD in English. I had a nagging thought, which I tried to ignore, that writing literary criticism wasn’t quite my bliss. I loved literature and I loved teaching literature, but I didn’t enjoy the lit crit industry. It seemed like literary critics wrote to other literary critics, and argued with and against their particular readings, and it seemed rather pointless. I had been writing down my dreams, trying to figure out why I was having these second thoughts now, when I was nearly finished with my dissertation. My sister invited me to attend a weekend workshop on dreams, and I immediately saw that studying dreams and writing about dreams had more relevance to the general population than writing literary criticism. Dream interpretation uses some of the same skills as literary interpretation, and dreams are as intriguing as literature. But everyone dreams, and each person’s dreams are tailor-made metaphorical stories about the dreamer’s life. I loved how the dreams could show my life in a symbolic way.

Also, I had interviewed for a teaching job which my friend, who worked at that school had assured me I would get. The interviews went well. I gave a presentation that went well. And I left fairly confident that I would receive a job offer. My dreams, however, basically told me that I would not get the job, long before the notice came. That intrigued me. How did my dreams know? The dreams prepared me, so that I was not as devastated as I might have been.

What led you to using dreams in your writing classes and therapy sessions?
I used dreams when I worked as a therapist because I found it easier to diagnose and figure out what was really going on with clients. Clients typically won’t tell a therapist everything; they don’t consciously conceal; but they wait to see if they can trust the person before spilling all of the “dirty laundry.” Dreams will get to the truth sooner than a usual therapy session. Especially when clients only have a limited number of sessions because of managed care, sometimes getting to the real reasons for needing therapy quickly are important. I found I could diagnose and formulate a treatment plan for clients after listening to a dream or two. Not all clients wanted to discuss dreams.

After I had worked as a therapist for a number of years, I missed teaching and decided to return to academia. I wanted to see if I could incorporate dreams into writing classes. I was interested in bringing information about dreams to a larger population than those who seek therapy. Everyone dreams every night, but more people do not take advantage of the information they receive from their dreams, usually because they do not know what to do with them. Universities typically do not teach classes on dreams, and this is a terrible mistake, in my opinion. Paying attention to one’s dreams could help students with everything from career decisions to problems with roommates and substance abuse. I thought that teaching a dream course could show students several methodologies to make their dreams work for them. In addition, I thought writing about dreams would be a way to make a writing course fun and not simply one of those required courses that students hate.

One of the things that frustrated me when I taught writing at UCLA was that the writing texts, which typically had contemporary essays, did not focus around a core subject. They had several. Typically the texts were organized around themes–education in America, race relations, feminism, the American dream, etc. When I became interested in dreams, I thought it would be fun (finally) to teach a writing class focused on one subject rather than several. And it was. I began teaching part-time at a private Catholic school, and eventually full-time.

I experimented with different texts and essay questions. I had joined the International Association for the Study of Dreams, and at their annual conferences they always have workshops on teaching dreams in the classroom. I incorporated many of the ideas from the annual conferences into my classes. I also had one of my favorite dream researchers, Kelly Bulkeley, come and speak at the college. One year we had a “Dream Club” where students who weren’t in my classes could come and discuss their dreams over lunch. I gave presentations on dreams after I attended conferences, and we even held a regional dream conference at the college in 2008. After teaching dreams in the classroom for several years, I am more than ever convinced that education about dreams should be a core subject in every university.

What is your favorite dream reference guide or website and why? Or what do you recommend to people interested in understanding dreams and dream symbolism better?
I have several favorite dream reference books. I like all of Kelly Bulkeley‘s books. The text I used in my writing class, “An Introduction to the Study of Dreams,” by Kelly Bulkeley is a good introduction for people who want basic information. The International Association for the Study of Dreams has a website with several links. That’s also a good place to find everything from introductory to more specialized information about dreams. I also like Jeremy Taylor‘s books on dreams. I have attended several of his workshops, which also provide good introductory information on dreams. Robert Hoss (another IASD member) has a methodology for working with one’s dreams alone, and I always taught my students his interpretive method. It is simple to learn, and good for people to know who do not feel comfortable sharing dreams with others. However, my bias is that dreams should be shared!

When someone has a memorable or unsettling dream, what is the best way to understand it better?
The best way to understand an unsettling dream is to tell three best friends, a spouse, a neighbor, your mother or father–people whom you trust. One student told me she would call her parents and tell them her dreams before she started writing her paper. Her parents didn’t know anything about dream interpretation, but they knew their daughter very well, and were therefore able to understand the metaphors in their daughter’s dreams. People who know you well will often intuitively understand your dreams. And just talking about them out loud will help you better hear what the dream is trying to tell you.

Anything else you would like our readers to understand about dreams that you have not already mentioned?
The more you pay attention to your dreams, the more your dreams will pay attention to you! If you show that you are interested in your dreams by writing them down, and by discussing them with a trusted friend or two, you dreams will gradually provide personal spiritual revelation. They can aid you in your creative endeavors, in your church chores, your career and family relationships.
***
Thank you, Barbara, for taking the time to answer! In the comments, I would love to hear your response to Barbara’s fabulous article. What have you learned as you pay attention to your dreams?

Comments

13 Responses to “Dreams as Spiritual Gifts: An Interview with Barbara Bishop”

Selwyn aka Kellie
May 14th, 2010 @ 1:37 am

I remember reading the article in the Segullah journal – and went straight back and reread it!

I haven’t had many dreams I remember, but since Barbara’s article I’ve had four that have been of huge significance to me. I absolutely agree that the more attention you pay to your dreams, the more they pay attention to you.

Thanks for the interview, article and reminder!
Tiffany W.
May 14th, 2010 @ 10:16 am

This was a fantastic post. I’ve always been sensitive to my dreams. But lately, I’ve been kind of ignoring them. Last night, I had a particularly vivid dream highlighting the ridiculous thing that is hanging over my head and driving me crazy. Time to rethink what I am allowing to control my life.
sar
May 14th, 2010 @ 12:12 pm

I loved that article and this interview. Thank you for both.
Shelah
May 14th, 2010 @ 12:24 pm

I really enjoyed working with Barbara through the process of this article. I wish I were more in tune with my dreams. When I do remember, they tend to worry me more than anything. Maybe all of my pent-up anxieties come out while I’m sleeping.
Leah Killian
May 14th, 2010 @ 5:04 pm

I’ve had many dreams that have had significant meaning. I’ve had many repetitive dreams, and I find that when I find out what they mean, I stop having them. That is good when the dream is scary or disturbing (like vividly dreaming you’re miscarrying every single night for 6 weeks when you aren’t even pregnant YIKES). It is too bad when it is a dream I like

I often dream the future- not in a weird “I can’t tell the future” kind of way, but to where a month or a year or even several years will go by and something will happen- never anything significant, usually simple, benign things like a conversation or the way something plays out, and I will distinctly remember dreaming that, and occasionally anticipate the next step by a matter of seconds..

I’ve had dreams years ago of my children and people I know now but didn’t at the time and dreams where I was working through situations that wouldn’t happen for several years. When it does happen it is kind of like psychic de ja vu lol! I just figure I must be on the right path if they keep coming true.
Emily M.
May 14th, 2010 @ 5:33 pm

Kellie, I think one of the best things for me is just that awareness that something in them is telling me stuff I need to know.

Tiffany, whenever I have a dream that stays with me I know it’s significant. So often I wake up and the dream floats away, but the ones that stay are ones that end up meaning something to me.

Sar, so glad you liked it.

Shelah, you are a fabulous editor. And I wish I were more in tune with my dreams too, the everyday ones and not just the more powerful ones that stay with me.

Leah, what a gift. Dreaming and interpreting dreams is a spiritual gift, and it sounds like you are very in tune with yours.

I repeat again the invitation to email me if you have addiction dreams or dreams regarding family members who are addicts, please email me and I will put you in contact with Barbara. I’ve read early drafts of her book on addiction dreams, and it’s going to be fantastic.
Barbara
May 14th, 2010 @ 11:27 pm

Thanks for all of the kind comments regarding the interview and essay. I love hearing that you are not only remembering your dreams, but also noticing when the metaphors come to call in waking life. Recurring dreams have particular significance. According to Jeremy Taylor, the dreams that repeat over and over have to do with our deepest wounds/issues/life tasks. And I really love it when I have moments in my life for which dreams prepared me, sometimes years before. To me it means I’m on my path.
Tiffany W.
May 15th, 2010 @ 12:43 pm

I’ve had recurring dreams over the years: one was horrifying and involved me fighting for my loved ones. It paralleled a particularly difficult experience I was having. When I made peace with the part of my life, the dreams stopped.
Another dream I had for several years varied in situation, but always included a terrifying staircase and going up it. I haven’t had that dream or any of its variations for a couple of years.
Again, thanks for the great post. It really got me thinking.
JenW
May 16th, 2010 @ 9:42 pm

These articles are fanning such a flame in me. I’m known in my family for having bizarre dreams but also some meaningful ones. I really can’t imagine the bizarre ones having any real significance, but maybe paying more attention to them would pay off a little?

In my late teens, I left the church for awhile. After a time, I began having dreams about the temple and a feeling of disappointment at not being able to go inside when others could. This was a feeling I never had in waking hours but it got me thinking about the things I might really want out of life. Those dreams along with some other very small details in life led me to try church again and I returned eventually to full activity.

A year or two later on my mission, I had a very vivid and disturbing dream about a newly baptized member. Upon telling my companion in the morning, we decided to call that person and we found that he was – just as had been shown in my dream – drowning in the muddy, sticky grasp of the adversary. There were other important dreams on my mission, but that was the most memorable.

Barbara, your #7 comment has me a little concerned. There is a recurring dream I’ve had for 5 years now and recently the dream has gotten longer and more vivid. The fact that I keep having the dream is much more disturbing to me than the dream itself. But I’ve no idea what I am supposed to do with this dream and the scene that plays out every time.

This has all been so thought-provoking and I’m thirsty for more information, so I appreciate the links and additional information provided here. Fascinating stuff, Barbara! Thanks so much for this.
Melissa Y.
May 16th, 2010 @ 9:43 pm

Just wanted to say thanks for the great post and for all of the links!
Emily M.
May 17th, 2010 @ 10:12 pm

Jen W., another link that I didn’t put in the interview is the dream dictionary found at Dreamhawk. It’s just one I found by googling, and Barbara has not endorsed it, but I’ve found it to be pretty helpful.

I had a recurring dream about the guy I dated before my mission which indicated we should not get married. Being blind and in love, I interpreted it the opposite way, but the dream’s meaning became very clear in retrospect.

I’m hoping that after she finishes her book on addiction dreams Barbara will expand this Segullah article into a full book. *crossing my fingers*
s.l.
May 18th, 2010 @ 6:46 pm

4 recent meaningful dreams:
1. a baby seal visited me with overwhelming amounts of love and playfulness, making me totally ready for another baby (I don’t even like animals).

2. dreamt my house burned and I lost my pictures. scared me, so I uploaded them to Picasa. within 2 weeks, my computer died irretrievably

3. dreamt a friend’s lawn was really a pretty green carpet laid out to cover years of decaying leaves underneath. I saw mushrooms growing through the carpet, which became so big they blocked out the sun. After confronting her, she admitted years of bulemia resulting now in massive depression.

4. Dreamt of a barrier surrounding my house (symbolically, me) and the date May 10, 2010. When, a month later, my OB/GYN tried to schedule an appointment that day, I knew it would not go well. Found another OB which saved me $100 and provided a much better patient experience.

Thank you for the references in this post!
s.l.
May 18th, 2010 @ 7:12 pm

I like the online dream dictionary at dreammoods.com it doesn’t require a download like dreamhawk…very simple search function, and quite complete

also the book “THE MIND AT NIGHT” by Andrea Rock describes sleep science (wade through or skip the first few chapters of neuro) with some amazing research conclusions