My fourteenth wedding anniversary was a couple of weeks ago. I didn’t know what to buy my husband to celebrate the auspicious occasion. After much searching, the Hugh Nibley and Mormon Tab CD I settled on didn’t seem quite what I was looking for. I wanted to get him something a little more racy. My online dictionary says that means: 1. Mildly shocking because of references to sex. 2. Full of energy or spirit. 3. With a distinctive quality or flavor. 4. Piquant in taste or smell. I wanted a gift that had all of the above. If one or any of these definitions has disquieted you, please stop reading HERE.
In our small Mormon town, a new shop has opened up that is called “Husband and Wife.” Three gigantic photos of beautiful embracing couples span the windows. These carefully placed window designs are meant to hide what is inside and entice desperate anniversary gift seekers to enter. It is a place to buy “intimate” items.
I was a bit nervous about going in. It wasn’t like this store had a thousand Walmart customers crashing through the doors. There wasn’t a soul in sight. A man in his early twenties greeted me.
“Hello. Welcome to Husband and Wife. What can I help you with?”
(Hmmm, what can this young punk know about anniversary gifts?) “I’m just going to look around, thank you.”
I couldn’t take it all in at once. Near the door, there were books by Carolyn Pearson and other LDS authors on the counter. There were bookmarks with scripture quotes, plastic roses, and lovely necklaces that could rival those in Deseret Book. My brain froze for a moment. Is this the right place? Am I in Deseret Book? I was just there buying my other boring gifts. Then I turned. There were racks of lacy teddies, camisoles, and see-through robes. Along two walls stood rows of plastic thighs (like the lamp in the movie The Christmas Story) with different types of nylons ”“ black, fishnet, lace, or gartered. The back wall was full of perfumes, lotions, and potions for any need. I perused. I strolled. I started laughing. It was just too contradictory for me. The young man approached.
“Can I help you find anything?”
Guffaw. “I’ve never seen anything like this place. It’s a Mormon porno store.”
His face turned deep red. His eyes bulged. I immediately saw the error of my hasty words. He turned abruptly and walked away. It was pretty obvious, HE WAS MAD!
“That is exactly the image that we were NOT going for!”
Suddenly, I felt really bad for what I said. “I’m so sorry. I didn’t mean to offend you, etc. etc. etc.” I don’t want to bore you with what ensued. Let’s just say, I felt sorry enough to the tune of forty dollars spent on four one-ounce vials labeled Kama Sutra that have yet to be opened. When he started explaining how to use them, I ran out of the store. Why be humiliated anymore?
So, what is the point of this story? As Mormons, what is our cultural sexual identity? Do we have one? I ask this question with trepidation since in our religion sex is seen as a very sacred act and is rarely discussed. Yet, based on plethora of primary kids in my ward, it happens a lot. As Mormon women, do we see ourselves as sexual divas, dowdy and repressed housewives, or as somewhere in between? How do our men see us? Unbeknownst to me, are women out buying purple teddies and garters and then going to the Distribution Center to get garments? Are we, as Mormons, content in our sexual relationships? Do we have healthy sex lives? Does it matter? Lots of questions. For a fieldtrip, perhaps we can all converge on the shop “Husband and Wife.” The owner might have the answers. If not, we can at least pick something up that is racy.
That sounds really, really weird. I grew up with parents who are very open and honest about sex. For example, my mom always jokingly called lingerie “recreational underwear”. I got lingerie for my bridal shower. I occasionally wear it. I guess I just assumed that most other Mormon women did the same–most of the time you wear your garments, obviously, but it’s OK to sometimes wear other stuff.
One of the reasons why I think it’s important not to talk about sex as “dirty” is so that people have permission to enjoy it once they are married. At the same time, this can be difficult because I personally don’t feel like discussing my sex life with very many people because it is so sacred and private. I do think it’s important for couples to have a healthy sex life, but it’s something difficult for people to talk about.
Wow–I would probably giggle in that store. Because a mormon man approaching me–too funny. But I have to say as mormon women–we need to shun the stigma of “good girls don’t” to good married girls do–all the time and they love it. Bring on the sexy underwear and confidence in the bedroom. Sadly, I don’t think most mormon girls feel that way. To those who don’t–I say read “And they were not ashamed”–it has helped many a girl. To the rest of us who do–CHEERS!
I was going to recommend that book as well. I also have enjoyed what I read of Wendy Watson’s book, Purity and Passion.
I think our sexual identity should go far beyond what you can find in a store, though. As much fun as it all can be, and should be, I think we ought to remember that it’s about as sacred as sacred gets. You can’t really sell what will make sexual intimacy as sweet as it can be. The Spirit is what does that, and an understanding of the doctrine. That’s why I liked Wendy Watson’s book. Brotherson’s book (And They Were Not Ashamed) is particularly good for those who need to get past the ‘good girl’ syndrome, and she gets to some of the doctrine. She also just has some practical helps for improving that aspect of life, particularly with the male-female differences with approach, attitude, physiology, etc. But Sister now-Nelson hits the ball out of the park and gets to what I think our LDS understanding of sexuality should get to. It’s different from anything I have read.
Buying lingerie or any other such products with a male clerk? What are they thinking? What kind of questions do they expect you to ask? How does this bra fit? Does it create cleavage?
I really like sister Brotherson’s book also. One thing this book made me realize is how many women have unhealthy attitudes about sex. A couple of weeks ago in RS when the lesson was on the law of chastity, it was disheartening to me to see how the topic was introduced with much embarrassment and it was brought to our attention with much laughter that 5 sisters were asked to teach before someone agreed. This is not an embarrassing topic. How will we ever teach our sons and daughters to have healthy attitudes about sex if this is how we relate to it? It bothers me immensely when people do not talk to their toddlers and use the proper names for genitilia, instead using code words to avoid actually saying penis or vulva. These are not dirty words unless talked about in a vulgar way. One of the reasons I won’t read Wendy Watson’s book (not to denigrate her, she is probably a great person) is because she encourages using new terms like co-creating love instead of sex and making love. The normal terminology for sex is not bad unless discussed in a vulgar way either. Such suggestions further stigmatize sex as bad in the LDS culture. Sex is sacred to people outside the LDS realm too. I don’t think changing the words helps LDS people understand sex better–but quite the opposite. It will become strange and foreign, as if LDS people have a different way of engaing in sexual intimacy than the rest the world. I sincerely hope that this does not become part of our sexual identity.
Does it matter if we have healthy sex lives? Emphatically yes. Sex lies in at the very essence of our purpose on earth. It is at the heart of our dearest and most sacred doctrines to be co-creators with God. Furthermore, we are taught that sex is given to married couples to bring us closer together. It is a great act of selflessness. Both parties simultaneously engage in the act of satisfying the other party’s spiritual, emotional, and perhaps most powerfully–physical needs/desires. I see it as selfish to not consider one’s spouse in sexual activity, or withhold physical affection when illness or other physical impairments do not prevent the natural expression of such affection.
I’m voting “Yes”, women are indeed buying purple (and blue and black and red and hot pink and fishnets…) and buying garments on the same day!
I don’t think we are much different than our non-LDS peers which share our values. If we aren’t satisfied, I hope we openly discuss our sexual needs with our husbands. (again Laura Brotherson’s book is great) I really hope LDS women see themselves as not just as wives and mothers, but as lovers–and strive to make improvements just as they would in any area of their lives. I hope their husbands see them this way too.
I love what all of you women have said here. Lovely, tastefully handled discussion and great points. Thanks for this post, Melonie!
Mel, fabulous post.
I was dying with laughter as I imagined this scene. They really, really need to have two clerks on duty at all times–one male and one female. And make sure these clerks are not wound up so tight. It’s a SEX STORE, after all!
You’re asking great questions. I think the world has twisted sex in so many directions that devout LDS might feel uncomfortable with some perfectly kosher aspects of sexuality, simply because of how the world portrays them. But I’m quite certain that chastity doesn’t require prudery.
I’ve read Watson’s book and liked a lot of what she had to say, although I think we’re setting ourselves up for more guilt if we expect to hear heavenly choirs singing during hot and sweaty interludes. For women especially, so much of sexual response is mentally/emotionally based–and I don’t think church-y thoughts during sex are the answer. But loving, emotionally charged thoughts can be. And these can most certainly be categorized as “spiritual” thoughts.
I feel sad for women who think sex is only for men’s pleasure, and for men who don’t take the time to find out how women’s bodies typically work, and what in particular works for their wife. I highly recommend Laura Brotherson’s “Straight Talk” on these topics:
http://www.strengtheningmarriage.com/qa.php
There was an article in today’s “Globe and Mail” about religious sex manuals and how they’re flying off the shelves. (Subheadlines: “The Missionary Position” and “Erotica for the Evangelical set.”) So I guess there’s some kind of sexual awakening going on in the religious sets.
I love to tell this story about generational differences:
At a bridal shower I went to, the bride-to-be was given lingerie by her room-mates. Old Great-Aunt Betsy was in the back corner during gift-opening time. When blushing bride opened the lingerie and held it up, we could hear Great Aunt’s voice from the back, “How’s she going to wear her garments under that?” We all giggled and moved along to the next present. But then, a moment or two later, I heard, “I SAID, how’s she going to wear her garments under that????” She expected an answer, and she wanted it NOW!
I highly recommend researching on-line extracurricular sexual enhancer itema for every one’s personal research. I would die to walk in a store too! However there is much to be learned from “appropriate” sites that are not porn promoting. Go to an LDS sex therapist, and you would get some healthy ways to make what God has given us even better. For some it is a very uncomfortable subject and a difficulty in marriage. For others it may be the most uniting and satisfying experience. I had a friend who was taught “no sex till marriage” her whole life but not the “when you do have sex”, on her wedding night she couldn’t come out of the bathroom after she put on her white nightie that had multiple little buttons down the front intentionally. Her husband kept asking her when she was coming out! She was hiding behind the door with shear fear! O.K. so as individual as sex is, I think a good book is always a good idea for newleyweds to see without shame, the act of “making love”.
Melonie,
I pray that the Husband and Wife store isn’t in business for long as that may just be the nerdiest Mormon idea I have ever heard of.
And I do find myself a sexual diva. Thanks for asking!
(Great post!)
I hope they had vibrators somewhere in that store… I’m happy that there IS a store that isn’t in essence smutty and hard to go into for mormon women. Realistically there are many, many things that can enhance lovemaking, and unfortunately many find the idea of trying things out that come from most sex-toy oriented stores dirty. Put some sex dice in there too! One die is an action, the other is a body part! I should franchise one of those! I was one of those sex is bad virgins, and it took us 6 years to fix that. I’m hoping to teach my children differently.
Great topic. It is important to talk about sex because otherwise we cannot protect our children. If we don’t tell our kids the truth, some of them are bound to get into trouble because of ignorance.
As a German Mormon, I have to say that I was shocked, for example, how poorly male Mormon teenagers and college students treated women. Things that my gentile German friends never would have dared to do appeared to be quite standard in Utah.
I am thinking of various acts bordering on coercion. I could observe guys shoving around women, holding young women by both wrists despite her protest, dry humping, or forcing women into cars every month. More often than not men displayed these behaviors on Church property such as chapel parking lots, CES buildings or BYU campus. Among German gentiles, any of that would have been unacceptable.
The reason why German gentiles treat women better than some Utah Mormons seems to be that the former are properly educated about sex in general and gender relations in particular.
On a different note, I also read Wendy Watson’s work but did not find it that useful.
Sex is sex. It is not a sacrament. That idea is only bound to generate more hang ups in some of Watson’s readers.
Watson is gerontologist, which means that she is an expert in old age. She is probably not the best person to dispense advice on sex.
great post! I think it is ridiculous the way we don’t talk about sex. When I was growing up, there was a nearby town that was predominantly Mormon (not in Utah) that had an extremely high teenage pregnancy rate. I was always baffled as to why. Then when I met my SIL, who came from that town, I discovered the reason. She was telling me about how a nurse ripped her baby off her nipple and damaged it, and she couldn’t even say the word nipple without whispering it. I realized then and there that people weren’t talking about sex because they thought it would give the kids ideas. Well, the kids already had ideas. The entire community needed some frank sex talks.
Sexuality is a beautiful thing and it is meant to be enjoyed by wife and husband. I’m always sad when you realize that a lot of women view it as a chore.
Hellmut, the idea that sex is a sacrament comes from a talk that Elder Holland gave at BYU. I’m not surprised that Watson used it. This talk helped my husband tremendously. He had also grown up with the sex is bad and was having a hard time adjusting to the idea of sex.
Also, isn’t Watson a therapist? I seem to recall reading some talks where she discusses some of her work as a marriage and family therapist.
I also did not find Watson’s book very useful. Brotherson’s book hits it right on the head—generally speaking Mormon girls have inhibitions about sex.
As I’ve read all these responses, there is such a huge variety of attitudes that I find myself pleasantly surprised.
Like a lot of people, my parents’ parents never talked about sex so mine never did either. I thought I would have inhibitions and real negativity towards sex because of that, but it turns out my husband does instead. I think the culture of your upbringing has a lot to do with it, but the church as a social culture also plays a huge role. It seems like the last 5-10 years there have been major efforts (as seen with the publication of all these books we’re mentioning) to identify the problem and provide a more healthy sex education for this next generation.
That is my goal—to teach my daughter BEFORE anyone else does, or does not, teach her about what sex is, what it means, why we do it, etc. Silence has been the prevailing educator among my family on the topic, and I hope to be a change agent in that area.
I’ve gotta comment on this one. I’ve actually ceen looking for an LDS blog that discussed this issue…I live in the same town that Melonie lives in, I’ve seen the store and I was happy because I was thinking that we needed somthing like that around here that didn’t have the name “Dirty Joe punsters” or the “Blue botique” which cater to the stripper clients in the state. Male or not I’d rather shop at a store like this with a “Mormon” theme that the others I’ve been to in the state. BTY what is the churches stance on the use of “sex toys” like vibrators? I’ve heard conflicting information on the issue…I really wish that sexuality was spoken of more often in the church, as a women I’m often frustrated about my percieved role as a women in the church, ie why female anatomy is the way it is. Why procreation is dependant on a mans ability to have pleasure during sexual intercourse vs women whom can procreate reguardless of pleasure. Any thoughts?
Belle, that’s a good question. I think women get the short end of the stick in a major way, on this particular point. But at the same time, men are much more likely to have to battle their sexuality than women (as far as expressing it only within divinely appointed limits). So there’s pros and cons either way.
The Church, thankfully, does not get specific about what is and isn’t acceptable (neither does Laura Brotherson, to her credit). Prophets have explicitly stated that it’s not true that “anything goes” if you’re married, and have spoken out against “unnatural practices,” but as far as particulars go, it’s a matter of the spirit, between the married partners and God.
Hellmut, I disagree with your statement that sex isn’t a sacrament. What happens in pornos is anything but a sacrament, but if enjoyed between people who “share everything” (in Elder Holland’s words), sex can most certainly be a holy thing, albeit in a way we might not be accustomed to thinking about it.
And I agree that Watson’s book is not of much use to anyone needing nuts-and-bolts information about sex. I very much appreciated her point, though, that women who want to be closer to their husbands emotionally and spiritually should work diligently on their sexual relationship.
p.s. And Belle, let’s be glad that the most sexually responsive parts of ourselves are not in the birth canal. Can you imagine the agony in childbirth if our most sensitive nerve endings were all grouped there? Yowza.
Kathryn thanks for your response…I gotta say that I must have a completly different perspective on this issue, reguardless of where our most sesiitive sexual responsive parts are located, it still doesn’t explain to me why God made men’s positive sexual response essential to procreation vs women (ie women could have been made so that sexual response was essential to procreation as well while still maintaining a birth canal). Also I don’t percieve that only men battle sexuality (I assume your speaking in terms of wondering eyes, porn, adultry), look at me I battle with my sexuality perhaps differently than a man but I still battle. One of my battles is in direct relation to male-sexuality. As women we may not have as many problems stepping outside of divine sexual pratices but we do have to live with male-sexual behavior and how that can personally harm us…I’ve watched women be detroyed emotionally/sexually because of male-sexual behavior ie porn addiction, rape, adultry, etc.
PS as a side note the only reason why I think women don’t have as much of an issue with porn is because it has been made for and marketing generally for men, however I think that if it where marketed and created more for women’s tastes that could perhaps change, I could be wrong but I think men and women equally have battles sexually, although differently and over differnt issues. (I’m a little long winded).
Belle, good points. I wish I had the answers! Certainly sex is a major issue for both men and women, in different ways. I’m definitely not saying that women have the easier battle.
Read Elder Holland’s conference talk /here.
I looked for the original talk on the BYU Devotional website, but they’ve taken it down. It’s the best talk on sex I have ever heard or read.
Thanks for a great post, Mel.
I have to comment that it’s rather sad to believe tht “God made men’s positive sexual response essential to procreation vs women” Forgive me, I’m not attacking.
In my opinion as far as procreation goes, the power is in the woman’s court strictly speaking. We are the creators of children, the incubators that could do with a turkey baster.
HOWEVER, sexual response is definitely easier for men! Can they REALLY enjoy it if we don’t? REALLY. They may as well drill a hole in the mattress if our pleasure is not important to them. At that point it’s not sex, intimacy or anything but release. Admittedly, sometimes release is just what some women could benefit from…. if they weren’t programmed against their own sexuality. I discovered that I didn’t enjoy sex for a long time because I wasn’t fully experiencing it. It took a vibrator and a brave, loving husband! A sex life is not something I would call sacred, but the friendship and warmth that comes from my husband when he receives physical intimacy is as good for me as him doing the dishes or putting away the laundry. In this way, our sex life improves our sacred marriage.
Not discounting victims of aggressive sexual control, the only time we are victims of male sexuality is when we allow ourselves to be. FIND YOUR VOICE! Talk about sex with your partner, it’s uncomfortable, but worth it.
I can’t help but wonder why “porno store” is what popped into your mind when you entered this store. Was there anything resembling pornography?
because she encourages using new terms like co-creating love instead of sex and making love. The normal terminology for sex is not bad unless discussed in a vulgar way either.
I haven’t fully been able to buy into her notion, either, but I don’t think she was trying to nasty-ize sex; I think she was trying to get us to think of it differently than the world does, and so she suggested talking about it differently.
BTW, I hope I made it clear that Sister Nelson’s book was not a nuts-and-bolts book; sorry if I didn’t. I also am not trying to suggest that the heat of passion should be something that makes us want to bear our testimony.
But I think there is great value in realizing that looking at sex as something without a spiritual element misses something important. Again, that doesn’t mean it can’t be fun, playful and meaningful in a physical way. But I personally think that especially in today’s oversexed society, we need to be sure that we aren’t losing the perspective of the divine purposes of the sexual relationship while we are seeking to enjoy that element of our marriages, and to improve it as well (such a process, that is).
Belle, I personally think that part of why we are created differently to teach us how to learn to come together as one, to be sensitive and aware of the other, to not let either of our personal needs drive the relationship, and to create a reality that considers both people, not just one. I also think that how we treat sexuality is a significant part of our mortal probationary test.
Michelle! What an awesome point! The partnership required to make it work must be divinely thought up!
What’s wrong with buying garmets and lingerie on the same day?
“I think she was trying to get us to think of it differently than the world does, and so she suggested talking about it differently”
But the whole world does not think of sex in a bad way. Sure, that is definatley in our faces and out there, but we as Mormons are not sexually different. We have sex the same way the rest of the world does. Our bodies respond sexually the same way non-Mormons do. Trying to set us apart here is very strange to me. Changing basic terminology for human biological function does not sex more spiritual make.
Furthermore, my personal preferance is not to read a book on the subject whose author has not engaged in conjugal relations in a marital relationship for the same reasons I would not choose to read a book on parenting from someone who has never parented a child. Credibility is seriously lacking.
I haven’t read any of the books in question. It does seem to me that trying to “holify” (yes, I made that word up) sex would complicate matters even more for women feeling guilty about sexual pleasure. Married women have already chosen to make their sexual relationships holy by putting them in the right context. Maybe it’s time for a different message, “It’s good to have fun with your husband. Strengthen the bonds that you share. Enjoy yourself.”
Amen Angie. Sacred is that we “saved” it for marriage. Now try and enjoy it, god wouldn’t have given us a clitoris if sex were just for procreation.
Annie (#23 and #30) I seem to have struck quite a chord with you…often perspective is the issue in these matters…I normally read blogs but choose not to respond to them because they often go on and on and on….with little resolve or change of perspective. But since I started writing this time here it goes, sigh.
#23 response: Physiologically speaking, procreation IS dependant upon a man acheiving climax (pleasure) in which ejaculation occurs, whether that is into a cup or a female vigina is up to the man and women generally speaking (aside from forceable rape). There also seems to be an assumption by you that I’m saying that all procration occurs without female enjoyment which is not what I said, what I said is I (personally) don’t understood why god made women’s ability to reach climax (pleasure) not dependant on procreation vs a man, that’s just fact…while I understand women’s persceptives on what consistutes “pleasure” may be different. ie the women whom says she finds pleasure in just pleasing her husband, that being on an emotional level is really not what I’m talking about.
Response #30: I also understand very well that the sole purpose of the clitoris is to bring women pleasure…obviously God gave us that for a reason, thankfully, because then seriously what would be the point. Also, um, I have never had a problem being open (within the divine context of marriage) sexually and DO enjoy a fulfilling sex life with my husband. These aren’t a “I’m not satisfied sexually” posts. In fact I was thinking earlier today (before I even read this blog while I was doing dishes this am) about how horrible it is that female circumcisms occur in some cultures and it occued to me that perhaps if female sexual-pleasure was associated with procreation than perhaps some of these barbaic practices wouldn’t occur, since procreation is very important to many of these cultures. After all it would be akin to cutting off a man’s penis. Just a thought.
Our stake President years ago told us when we got our interview for a Temple marriage (and this guy was as spiritual a man I ever met) the nicer you are to each other outside the bedroom the better things are inside the bedroom. With several years of constant open communication and practice, his counsel to us was prophetic. We are not vocal about our satisfaction; it is one of the few special things we can share as husband and wife that no one else gets involved in and it is very fulfilling.
Belle, I offended you. I’m sorry. It wasn’t my intention.
But the whole world does not think of sex in a bad way.
Sorry…I must not be making my point clearly enough. I’m not necessarily saying the whole world thinks of sex in a bad way. But I am pretty sure that very few in the world really think of sex as a sacred element of a God-sanctioned relationship. Sex can be not-bad but still not have the significance that it does in the plan of salvation. That is my view of why Sister Nelson said what she said, but I could have been reading her wrong. I think it’s less about ‘they are doing it WRONG and you can do it RIGHT by calling it something else’ but more about just trying to encourage a paradigm shift, different from what even many members of the Church may not appreciate. It’s too easy to have a pretty temporal view of this topic, which isn’t necessarily BAD at all but it may not be the BEST. I doubt she thinks that simply changing names would change the whole picture, but as part of a new way of approaching this aspect of life, I can understand what she was getting at.
Does that make more sense?
I do understand the whole ‘how can she write a book without having been married’ but I do think someone can teach true principles even without having experienced them all. I knew motherhood and marriage were divine before I experienced them. Sheri Dew gave some of the best talks on these topics without having experienced them. The Spirit can work that way. I imagine that in her years and years of counseling, she was able to discern truth and what worked. I trust that, even if perhaps the reality of implementing ideals. All I know is that what I read (I haven’t read it all) really felt good and right, for me. What I have found, though, is that sometimes a book will come along that is what I needed at that time, but won’t necessarily have the same impact for someone else. Dif’rent strokes and all that.
Ah, I wax longwinded….
So many too respond to! You have all said such wonderful and interesting comments. I really appreciate how open you are and willing to discuss these issues. I am pleasantly surprised! I thought that I would get a barage of “How dare you, Melonie! You shouldn’t be writing about this.” So, thank you.
I really liked Michelle’s comment, “I think our sexual identity should go far beyond what you can find in a store.” Very nicely put.
I haven’t read Wendy Watson’s book, but considering she was a virgin until in her mid-50’s and then started making love to a man in his 70’s, (don’t quote me on those ages), I might look for someone to read who has had a little more experience.
Belle, you brought up some interesting points I hadn’t considered before. However, my sister has two daughters from artificial insemination. She’s never slept with a man. The current world’s views on sexuality and parenting are in chaos.
As Mormon women, it is very important that we speak to our children frankly and responsibly about sex-including all of its wonderfulness and its oddities.
Now some personal responses:
Steve- nothing suggested to me a porn store except the fishnet stockings. Really, it was very tasteful. It was just the unexpected LDS books mixed in with the massage oils that threw me for a loop. I didn’t know what to expect and since I have a limited vocabulary - Mormon porn store is what spewed out. What should I have called it? “This is quite a Mormon intimate apparel and KYJelly store you have here!” I should have just kept quiet.
Hellmut - Having lived in Germany for almost 5 years, I did not see one incident of a man bullying a woman. However, I witnessed many on the U.S. Air Force Base. I don’t know what to say - it is sad we don’t teach more respect for one another. As far as Mormon men goes, let’s hope that isn’t the case for the majority. But, having had three attempted dry humps on me when I was in my early twenties, I believe disrespectful actions happen more often than we realize. Just goes to show we need to talk to our girls. Some might not even know what the boy is doing.
And, I did go into a “Blue Boutique” type store in Germany and WOW those Germans know how to get things going. Glad I married one…hee, hee.
Angie - Nothing is wrong with buying things on the same day. I didn’t say that. I just wondered if women were doing it. Want to go shopping?
Darlene - Well, what happened next? Did someone explain it to her?
I’m with Kathryn on being happy the church has no stance on what goes on in the bedroom between husband and wife. I think I’d be really upset if they did.
Thanks again for your insightful comments.
Oh, no. I didn’t put in my name above and I can’t delete it. Now you all know I’m RahRahSisBoomBah! I’ll need a new anonymous name - like twinkletoes!
Melonie
As a guy once put it in my Human Sexual Behavior class at ASU (I’m paraphrasing it)
“There are times for making love and there are times for just “gettin’ busy”
‘
I hear that.
[...] they don’t let you take photos in there. I’ll just have to go find out. (oh, look - someone went already and reported back. Now you know I’ve got to go see for myself. They’re selling religious stuff at an [...]
I also am not trying to suggest that the heat of passion should be something that makes us want to bear our testimony.
Michelle, you made my day with that quip!
Thanks for all the questions Melonie and the food for thought everyone else.
There’s been so much said, I don’t even know what to add. But I will say that knowing my mom had some lingerie she packed up for vacations with my dad didn’t hurt my attitude toward sex at all. And for our second anniversary my husband and I went to Barnes and Noble to peruse the section of sex books and were very pleased to find one written specifically for people in committed relationships that just gave us some good advice and ideas. We had the other books written by church members that talked about the doctrine of it, but we needed some help with the mechanics and hey, it helps. A good fitting leopard print bra can help sometimes too.