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	<title>Comments on: The perfect testimony?</title>
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	<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/</link>
	<description>Mormon women blogging about the peculiar and the treasured</description>
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		<title>By: lee</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-132663</link>
		<dc:creator>lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Mar 2009 18:20:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-132663</guid>
		<description>oh here&#039;s one:  Once a really old man got up and staggered to the pulpit.  All he said was &quot;How anyone can doubt that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God is beyond me.  In the name of Jesus Christ Amen.&quot;  Succinct, powerful, sincere, memorable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>oh here&#8217;s one:  Once a really old man got up and staggered to the pulpit.  All he said was &#8220;How anyone can doubt that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God is beyond me.  In the name of Jesus Christ Amen.&#8221;  Succinct, powerful, sincere, memorable.</p>
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		<title>By: Tamlynn</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131901</link>
		<dc:creator>Tamlynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Mar 2009 06:52:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131901</guid>
		<description>cjane- I loved that quote from Elder Jenson because for the longest time I believed I couldn&#039;t bear my testimony unless some significant event had occurred the previous week that I could talk about.

foxyj- I have a huge problem with the 12 and over ruling. How dare someone prohibit any baptized member of our church from publicly bearing testimony during a testimony meeting? A person doesn&#039;t even have to be baptized to have a testimony! Oh, I&#039;m too mad about that stupid idea to write coherently. Good luck in your stake, lol.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>cjane- I loved that quote from Elder Jenson because for the longest time I believed I couldn&#8217;t bear my testimony unless some significant event had occurred the previous week that I could talk about.</p>
<p>foxyj- I have a huge problem with the 12 and over ruling. How dare someone prohibit any baptized member of our church from publicly bearing testimony during a testimony meeting? A person doesn&#8217;t even have to be baptized to have a testimony! Oh, I&#8217;m too mad about that stupid idea to write coherently. Good luck in your stake, lol.</p>
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		<title>By: c jane</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131895</link>
		<dc:creator>c jane</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Mar 2009 05:37:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131895</guid>
		<description>Perhaps the problem is that we don&#039;t know what it is like to bear pure testimony. How often do we attend testimony meeting where members limit their words to declarations of truth based on the restored gospel of Jesus Christ? 

Or, likewise, how often have we tried to focus our testimonies on only the first principles of the gospel?

Let me quote from Elder Ballard&#039;s talk &quot;Pure Testimony&quot; (a must read before asking Nine Women, though they are wonderful women, no doubt . . .)
&quot; . . .our meetings sometimes lack the testimony-rich, spiritual underpinnings that stir the soul and have meaningful, positive impact on the lives of all those who hear them.&quot;

There is power in stating those words. Those words only. By virtue of their truthfulness nothing needs to be added to or expounded upon. Stories shared don&#039;t compare to what a simple statement can do for the soul.

I plead with anyone to try it. Sometimes bearing pure testimony (declarations of truth FROM THE FIRST PRINCIPLES OF THE GOSPEL starting with I know, I believe, I declare . . .)acts as a catalyst for more knowledge.

Also, I feel to add that these statements of truth (being referred to as the &quot;5 things&quot; in this thread) are most definitely not guidelines. They ARE testimony. Elder Ballard says 

&quot;Although we can have testimonies of many things as members of the Church, there are basic truths we need to constantly teach one another and share with those not of our faith. Testify God is our Father and Jesus is the Christ. The plan of salvation is centered on the Savior’s Atonement. Joseph Smith restored the fulness of the everlasting gospel of Jesus Christ, and the Book of Mormon is evidence that our testimony is true.&quot; (From his talk, Pure Testimony).

Sharing a truth and adding to it with a story is also not bearing pure testimony. As Elder Jenson teaches, a testimony is &quot;Not an experience, although experiences may illustrate belief and conviction.&quot; 

We tend to complicate a really simple and powerful opportunity. There is nothing rote about it, there is no happy medium either--done with the Spirit it can be an epic experience of Mormonism.

I so testify . . .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perhaps the problem is that we don&#8217;t know what it is like to bear pure testimony. How often do we attend testimony meeting where members limit their words to declarations of truth based on the restored gospel of Jesus Christ? </p>
<p>Or, likewise, how often have we tried to focus our testimonies on only the first principles of the gospel?</p>
<p>Let me quote from Elder Ballard&#8217;s talk &#8220;Pure Testimony&#8221; (a must read before asking Nine Women, though they are wonderful women, no doubt . . .)<br />
&#8221; . . .our meetings sometimes lack the testimony-rich, spiritual underpinnings that stir the soul and have meaningful, positive impact on the lives of all those who hear them.&#8221;</p>
<p>There is power in stating those words. Those words only. By virtue of their truthfulness nothing needs to be added to or expounded upon. Stories shared don&#8217;t compare to what a simple statement can do for the soul.</p>
<p>I plead with anyone to try it. Sometimes bearing pure testimony (declarations of truth FROM THE FIRST PRINCIPLES OF THE GOSPEL starting with I know, I believe, I declare . . .)acts as a catalyst for more knowledge.</p>
<p>Also, I feel to add that these statements of truth (being referred to as the &#8220;5 things&#8221; in this thread) are most definitely not guidelines. They ARE testimony. Elder Ballard says </p>
<p>&#8220;Although we can have testimonies of many things as members of the Church, there are basic truths we need to constantly teach one another and share with those not of our faith. Testify God is our Father and Jesus is the Christ. The plan of salvation is centered on the Savior’s Atonement. Joseph Smith restored the fulness of the everlasting gospel of Jesus Christ, and the Book of Mormon is evidence that our testimony is true.&#8221; (From his talk, Pure Testimony).</p>
<p>Sharing a truth and adding to it with a story is also not bearing pure testimony. As Elder Jenson teaches, a testimony is &#8220;Not an experience, although experiences may illustrate belief and conviction.&#8221; </p>
<p>We tend to complicate a really simple and powerful opportunity. There is nothing rote about it, there is no happy medium either&#8211;done with the Spirit it can be an epic experience of Mormonism.</p>
<p>I so testify . . .</p>
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		<title>By: Claudia</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131876</link>
		<dc:creator>Claudia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Mar 2009 00:09:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131876</guid>
		<description>Any testimony that isn&#039;t prepared ahead of time and written down on a piece of paper that will take 20 minutes to read; any testimony that comes from the heart and contains somewhere in it a witness of the Savior or expresses gratitude I think is appropriate.
 
When my children wanted to bear their testimonies at a young age I would ask them what it was they wanted to say. When they were aware enough of what the meeting was about and could get up without help and say what was in their hearts they were encouraged to participate. It was not at the same age for each child. Some of them did it early and often some of them did not.

Not every testimony speaks to every person. Sometimes what I am unhappy with fills a need for someone else in the congregation. When I feel prompted I bear my testimony. When the spirit my witness and builds my faith I think that is good enough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Any testimony that isn&#8217;t prepared ahead of time and written down on a piece of paper that will take 20 minutes to read; any testimony that comes from the heart and contains somewhere in it a witness of the Savior or expresses gratitude I think is appropriate.</p>
<p>When my children wanted to bear their testimonies at a young age I would ask them what it was they wanted to say. When they were aware enough of what the meeting was about and could get up without help and say what was in their hearts they were encouraged to participate. It was not at the same age for each child. Some of them did it early and often some of them did not.</p>
<p>Not every testimony speaks to every person. Sometimes what I am unhappy with fills a need for someone else in the congregation. When I feel prompted I bear my testimony. When the spirit my witness and builds my faith I think that is good enough.</p>
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		<title>By: Marie</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131860</link>
		<dc:creator>Marie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 21:00:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131860</guid>
		<description>I, too, agree with the comments made here so far.  I rarely bear my testimony in church these days.  I find it hard to work up the courage sometimes and sometimes I just don&#039;t feel prompted to do so.  

I appreciate the brethren&#039;s suggestion that testimonies and prayers be kept short and sweet, focusing on the gospel and not on other things.  I love this and feel it very east to still bear testimony and share my love and my heart while still keeping withing those suggestions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I, too, agree with the comments made here so far.  I rarely bear my testimony in church these days.  I find it hard to work up the courage sometimes and sometimes I just don&#8217;t feel prompted to do so.  </p>
<p>I appreciate the brethren&#8217;s suggestion that testimonies and prayers be kept short and sweet, focusing on the gospel and not on other things.  I love this and feel it very east to still bear testimony and share my love and my heart while still keeping withing those suggestions.</p>
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		<title>By: angie f</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131839</link>
		<dc:creator>angie f</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 19:00:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131839</guid>
		<description>I have heard tender powerful testimonies from young children, but far more robotic parroting and as a result have struggled with knowing when my children are prepared and ready to share their testimonies outside primary talks and FHE.  The over 12 rule sounds like a harsh backlash from too many &quot;primary only&quot; sacrament meetings where parents did not respond to kinder gentler counsel.  I&#039;m glad our stake hasn&#039;t gone that far--either way.  I agree that I find testimonies most powerful when they are brief but when they share how knowledge has been attained.  I find I bear my testimony most coherently when I am able to tie my tender feelings to a specific experience with a gospel principle because I come from a long line of weepers and otherwise my testimony would become an unintelligible blubberfest.  I find our meetings are the most tender and powerfully Spirit filled when the member of the bishopric who opens the meeting with his testimony bears it about a particular aspect of the gospel and how his testimony in that area has recently grown.  It seems to lead the meeting in a similar direction.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have heard tender powerful testimonies from young children, but far more robotic parroting and as a result have struggled with knowing when my children are prepared and ready to share their testimonies outside primary talks and FHE.  The over 12 rule sounds like a harsh backlash from too many &#8220;primary only&#8221; sacrament meetings where parents did not respond to kinder gentler counsel.  I&#8217;m glad our stake hasn&#8217;t gone that far&#8211;either way.  I agree that I find testimonies most powerful when they are brief but when they share how knowledge has been attained.  I find I bear my testimony most coherently when I am able to tie my tender feelings to a specific experience with a gospel principle because I come from a long line of weepers and otherwise my testimony would become an unintelligible blubberfest.  I find our meetings are the most tender and powerfully Spirit filled when the member of the bishopric who opens the meeting with his testimony bears it about a particular aspect of the gospel and how his testimony in that area has recently grown.  It seems to lead the meeting in a similar direction.</p>
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		<title>By: Kristine</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131831</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 17:20:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131831</guid>
		<description>back in college @ BYUI (almost 10 years ago) we were encouraged to focus our testimonies by starting them with:

&quot;I know . . .&quot;
&quot;I testify . . .&quot;
&quot;I bear witness . . .&quot;
etc.

and then very quickly explain how you &quot;know&quot;.  I have found that this really helps me.  So I don&#039;t necessarily focus on &quot;5 things&quot; but I try to stick to just one or two principles of the gospel (christlike love, peace found at the temple, etc.).

I am personally someone who loves to give their testimony way more than ever giving a talk.  So I probably go up 6-8 times per year.  Sometimes when the meeting has gone off track I feel compelled to get up and give a short, focused, Savior testimony.

You would be surprised how often it works.  After I get up several other people usually get up, comment about my simple, short testimony and give one of their own.

I encourage you all to experiment the same way! If your testimony meeting is going down the tanker, try to get it back on track yourself :-) !</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>back in college @ BYUI (almost 10 years ago) we were encouraged to focus our testimonies by starting them with:</p>
<p>&#8220;I know . . .&#8221;<br />
&#8220;I testify . . .&#8221;<br />
&#8220;I bear witness . . .&#8221;<br />
etc.</p>
<p>and then very quickly explain how you &#8220;know&#8221;.  I have found that this really helps me.  So I don&#8217;t necessarily focus on &#8220;5 things&#8221; but I try to stick to just one or two principles of the gospel (christlike love, peace found at the temple, etc.).</p>
<p>I am personally someone who loves to give their testimony way more than ever giving a talk.  So I probably go up 6-8 times per year.  Sometimes when the meeting has gone off track I feel compelled to get up and give a short, focused, Savior testimony.</p>
<p>You would be surprised how often it works.  After I get up several other people usually get up, comment about my simple, short testimony and give one of their own.</p>
<p>I encourage you all to experiment the same way! If your testimony meeting is going down the tanker, try to get it back on track yourself <img src='http://segullah.org/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' />  !</p>
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		<title>By: Red</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131823</link>
		<dc:creator>Red</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:25:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131823</guid>
		<description>I appreciate almost all testimonies because I know it&#039;s difficult to get up in front of everyone and &quot;put yourself out there.&quot; My ward&#039;s culture results in very short testimonies and I often feel like I am not getting to know anyone in a real or personal way: it sometimes feels robotic, like the more solemn and serious and impersonal you express yourself, the more spiritually serious and doctrinally grounded your testimony.

And children never bear testimony in our ward. I find it a disappointment. 1) Because my children are learning that for some reason bearing testimony is hard or distasteful (that must be why children don&#039;t do it, right?) and 2) I really appreciate the simple testimonies of children. And I do think they can have testimonies and beliefs at a young age.

The commments make it seem like most people don&#039;t like children bearing testimony. Is that really true?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I appreciate almost all testimonies because I know it&#8217;s difficult to get up in front of everyone and &#8220;put yourself out there.&#8221; My ward&#8217;s culture results in very short testimonies and I often feel like I am not getting to know anyone in a real or personal way: it sometimes feels robotic, like the more solemn and serious and impersonal you express yourself, the more spiritually serious and doctrinally grounded your testimony.</p>
<p>And children never bear testimony in our ward. I find it a disappointment. 1) Because my children are learning that for some reason bearing testimony is hard or distasteful (that must be why children don&#8217;t do it, right?) and 2) I really appreciate the simple testimonies of children. And I do think they can have testimonies and beliefs at a young age.</p>
<p>The commments make it seem like most people don&#8217;t like children bearing testimony. Is that really true?</p>
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		<title>By: lee</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131813</link>
		<dc:creator>lee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 15:05:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131813</guid>
		<description>In my ward the people who have real testimonies and actually live the gospel sit quietly and say nothing.  Its &quot;open mike&quot; for the fringe elements and people who are either not bearing testimony, or are saying words their deeds don&#039;t back up.  Its kind of a frustrating freak-show.  

I know that doesn&#039;t sound very charitable, but truly, there are a lot of folks out there who just want the attention and whose &quot;testimonies&quot; aren&#039;t very relevant because of how they live.  When they get up one after another, the spirit leaves and the people with real testimonies seem to shrink lower and lower into their seats.

Granted this is not all the time, but it is pretty common in my ward.  And our bishop (bless him) is constantly urging people to keep it short and talk about the savior.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In my ward the people who have real testimonies and actually live the gospel sit quietly and say nothing.  Its &#8220;open mike&#8221; for the fringe elements and people who are either not bearing testimony, or are saying words their deeds don&#8217;t back up.  Its kind of a frustrating freak-show.  </p>
<p>I know that doesn&#8217;t sound very charitable, but truly, there are a lot of folks out there who just want the attention and whose &#8220;testimonies&#8221; aren&#8217;t very relevant because of how they live.  When they get up one after another, the spirit leaves and the people with real testimonies seem to shrink lower and lower into their seats.</p>
<p>Granted this is not all the time, but it is pretty common in my ward.  And our bishop (bless him) is constantly urging people to keep it short and talk about the savior.</p>
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		<title>By: dalene</title>
		<link>http://segullah.org/up-close/ask-nine-women/the-perfect-testimony/#comment-131802</link>
		<dc:creator>dalene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Mar 2009 13:47:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://segullah.org/?p=2348#comment-131802</guid>
		<description>Foxy J--I wouldn&#039;t be at all comfortable with such a blanket rule either. I have heard poignant testimony come from people under 12 and anything but coming from people old enough to know better.

People need to learn and two of the best ways to is by doing and by seeing what touches you--as well as what doesn&#039;t--when someone else has a go.

I&#039;m pretty laid back when it comes to bearing testimony. That said, I do appreciate it when parents take the time to teach their children how to do so properly and when adults keep it real. Some of my favorite experiences have been when someone can make me laugh and cry in the same five minutes. But always, always testimony should be based on truth. When people bear witness of real truth I think the spirit can confirm that in our hearts no matter how it&#039;s been expressed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Foxy J&#8211;I wouldn&#8217;t be at all comfortable with such a blanket rule either. I have heard poignant testimony come from people under 12 and anything but coming from people old enough to know better.</p>
<p>People need to learn and two of the best ways to is by doing and by seeing what touches you&#8211;as well as what doesn&#8217;t&#8211;when someone else has a go.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m pretty laid back when it comes to bearing testimony. That said, I do appreciate it when parents take the time to teach their children how to do so properly and when adults keep it real. Some of my favorite experiences have been when someone can make me laugh and cry in the same five minutes. But always, always testimony should be based on truth. When people bear witness of real truth I think the spirit can confirm that in our hearts no matter how it&#8217;s been expressed.</p>
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